Do Wins from the Champs Spinoffs Count as Wins?

With all of the Challenge spinoffs, a “win” doesn’t always count as a win. This topic has became heavily debated, especially around the Invasion era, but the subject has only become more heated as the franchise progressed.

Generally, Challenge fans accept any main series victory as a true win, even the early seasons without eliminations. The majority of people also consider All Stars seasons as wins, and The Challenge: USA and the global spinoffs also count as victories.

But, there was one spinoff trilogy before these shows: The “Champs” spinoffs, which include Champs vs. Pros, Champs vs. Stars, and Champs vs. Stars 2. And most Challenge fans don’t count these seasons as victories.

There are two main reasons people say these spinoff victories don’t count: Because it was filmed over a briefer period and it was less competitive.

Firstly, I’m not fully sure why people think the duration of the show matters. Perhaps it matters when production is paying people, but for the viewer, it doesn’t have a major impact. That’s because there were still many eliminations and the cast dwindled down to a small number in the final.

Only six people made each final — 30% of the cast. Comparitively, War of the Worlds 2 had 38% of the cast in the final and Inferno seasons were designed to have 60%.

But, those numbers don’t mean much when you consider that many of the players (particularly the Pros and Stars) weren’t really in it to win it. People like T.O. and Hennessy just quit and players like Riff Raff turned the game into a joke.

Even if we omit all of the stars and the pros (because none of them ever won a season) the win rate was 20% or 30% based on Champs alone — greater than Gauntlet and Inferno seasons. Admittedly, this is a higher win rate than the main series seasons of the era, but the people on the show were tough competition. Darrell had to outperform Bananas, Wes, CT, and Jordan to win Champs vs. Pros. Plus, there were people like Lolo, Louise, and Matt Rife in the mix who were playing to win.

There are moments in every season that feel competitive, regardless of how long the show was filming. But, there is one thing that would discredit this show.

Many cast members just didn’t care about winning charity money. They showed up for the appearance fees, not the grand prize. And I do think this is true for some players, but ultimately, there are people on every season that just want the camera time and know they won’t make it to the final.

Statistically, I would argue that winning a Champs spinoff is more significant than many main series seasons, and I do think they should count.

But, the argument is mostly moot because most of the show’s winners have already won the main series. So, if there was another Invasion or an all-Champs season, most of the people cast as “Champs” already had the title. But I do think Tony should qualify for a Champs-only season, especially if people like Jonna or Kaz qualify.